Allouch: No point in a Hariri-Nasrallah meeting now

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Future Movement official Mustafa Allouch told Akhbar al-Yawm news agency on Wednesday that a meeting between Prime Minister Saad Hariri and Hezbollah Secretary General Sayyed Hassan Nasrallah will not take place anytime soon.

“If there are any benefits from such a meeting, then it will happen, but given the current conditions , I don’t believe there is a point in it taking place,” he stated.

Asked whether Hariri’s trip to Iran will restore contacts between him and Hezboullah Secretary General Sayyed Hassan Nasrallah, he said: “The Iranians advised Hariri to resume contacts with Nasrallah , but there are clear and major differences between Hariri and Nasrallah’s positions over the Special Tribunal for Lebanon (STL) .”

Responding to Hezbollah Deputy Secretary General Sheikh Naim Qassem’s call on Hariri to stop the “farce” of the STL, Allouch said that “it is not Hariri that is accusing Hezbollah.”

Qassem told an Arab-language newspaper Wednesday it was looking to Prime Minister Saad Hariri to stop the “farce of accusation” against his movement.

“We are not asking for a statement from Hariri, but for action,” Hezbollah’s al-Manar quoted him as saying.

Qassem also said yesterday that a meeting between Hariri and Nasrallah could take place “when appropriate, beneficial and essential topics of discussion are found.” “Afterward it will only take a phone call or a couple of hours to set up a meeting,” he said.

“The farce is that there is a premature defense before the [STL’s] indictment is issued. The important thing is that if the indictment accuses anyone based on firm evidence, regardless of political affiliation, Sheikh Qassem and others must accept it.” Allouch said

Syrian-Saudi efforts toward a compromise have made progress but there is still a wide gap between “those who want to deal logically with the tribunal and those who want to abolish it completely,” he said.

“I do not think that Saudi-Syrian efforts will be successful in resolving the crisis .” He said

Asked about President Michel Suleiman’s meetings today with a number of political leaders , Alloush said: “The president is trying, but each one of these leaders is committed to a agenda that is not in line with Suleiman’s objectives.”

“The president has no solutions for a consensus on the STL and therefore, his efforts are appreciated, but they may not reach a concrete result,” he added.

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72 responses to “Allouch: No point in a Hariri-Nasrallah meeting now”

  1. PROPHET.T Avatar

    The great minister of defense of the state of Lebanon with his great strategy to defend the nation against Israel’s expected attack.Well exposed.what a shame….

    Full Document
    VZCZCXRO1782
    OO RUEHBC RUEHDE RUEHKUK RUEHROV
    DE RUEHLB #0372/01 0711608
    ZNY SSSSS ZZH
    O 111608Z MAR 08
    FM AMEMBASSY BEIRUT
    TO RUEHC/SECSTATE WASHDC IMMEDIATE 1273
    INFO RUEHEE/ARAB LEAGUE COLLECTIVE PRIORITY
    RUEHROV/AMEMBASSY VATICAN PRIORITY 1112
    RUEKJCS/SECDEF WASHDC PRIORITY
    RHMFISS/HQ USEUCOM VAIHINGEN GE PRIORITY
    RUCNDT/USMISSION USUN NEW YORK PRIORITY 2041
    RUEHNO/USMISSION USNATO PRIORITY 2308
    RHEHNSC/NSC WASHDC PRIORITY
    RHMFISS/CDR USCENTCOM MACDILL AFB FL PRIORITY
    Content
    S E C R E T SECTION 01 OF 04 BEIRUT 000372
    SIPDIS
    NOFORN
    SIPDIS
    DEPT PASS TO EU MEMBER STATES COLLECTIVE
    NSC FOR ABRAMS/SINGH/YERGER
    E.O. 12958: DECL: 03/10/2018
    TAGS: PGOV, PREL, PTER, PARM, PINR, SY, IS, LE
    SUBJECT: LEBANON: MINDEF WORRIED THAT HIZBALLAH WAR WITH
    ISRAEL IMMINENT
    REF: A. BEIRUT 355
    B. IIR 6 857 0185 08
    C. IIR 6 857 0189 08
    D. BEIRUT 324
    BEIRUT 00000372 001.2 OF 004
    Classified By: Charge D’Affaires a.i. Michele J. Sison
    for reasons 1.4 (b) and (d).
    SUMMARY
    ——-
    1. (S) In a March 10 meeting with Charge, MinDef Murr
    expressed his growing concern that a Hizballah war with
    Israel is imminent. His assessment is based upon recent
    Hizballah preparations, reported movement of families, and
    the precipitous increase in Israeli overflights of Lebanon.
    Murr does not think that Hizballah can win another war with
    Israel and will be defeated. Describing Hizballah as
    “scared,” Murr opined that they are scared because they know
    that Israel might be about to attack, or, more probably, they
    fear the retribution Israel will heap upon them when
    Hizballah takes revenge for the killing of terrorist Imad
    Mughniya. Murr offered some ideas aimed at avoiding turning
    the Christian population against Israel when the next war
    with Hizballah occurs. Murr also outlined his orders to the
    Lebanese Army when/if Israel invades to counter Hizballah.
    End summary.
    2. (S) Charge, Defense Attache and ODC Chief met with Deputy
    Prime Minister and Minister of Defense Elias Murr on March 10
    at his home in Rabieh. The atmosphere of the meeting was
    cordial and friendly.
    HIZBALLAH MEMBERS RENTING SUMMER HOMES;
    NOT ALL REPORTED ACTIVITY
    DIRECTLY RELATED TO WAR PLANNING
    —————————————
    3. (S) Contacts such as Amine Gemayel (ref A) and Walid
    Jumblatt have been telling us recently that the Shia, and in
    particular senior Hizballah members, have been acquiring land
    or renting homes in the Christian areas of Jezzine, Jebel
    Rihan, Junieh, Zahle as well as in Druze areas. This is
    causing alarm among the Christian populations in these
    locations and is being taken as a sign by some that Hizballah
    is planning for war.
    4. (S) MinDef Murr told us that he has looked into these
    rumors and, indeed, it was impossible to find a rental
    property in these areas. Regarding the activity in Jezzine,
    Murr assured us that this was nothing more than investing in
    Lebanon by Lebanese Shia expats based in West Africa. As for
    the buying of Christian properties, Murr reported that the
    Christians want to sell their property so they can leave
    Lebanon. In any case, Murr did not see a military linkage
    between the sale of homes in Jezzine and Hizballah planning.
    5. (S) As for the areas further north in Lebanon such as
    Keserwan and the Metn, Murr confirmed that Shia are renting
    in high numbers there because they feel that Israel is going
    to attack soon. Such action could take place as early as
    April 2008, he warned. (Comment: Shia took refuge
    throughout Christian areas in south Lebanon during the July
    2006 war, with as many as 300-400 people crowded into a
    single church for weeks on end. End Comment.) Murr also told
    us that Hassan Nasrallah’s cousin has moved his family out of
    the southern suburbs, the Dahiyya, and rented a chalet in the
    resort town of Farayya for a year. According to Murr, this
    means that Nasrallah is on high alert.
    6. (S) In addition to renting homes in these areas, Hizballah
    is making many concessions to the Christians who live in
    these areas. In a meeting three weeks ago between top
    Hizballah officials such as Wafiq Safa and March 14 members
    at MoD Headquarters in Yarze, Hizballah agreed to all of the
    Christians demands. The two most notable concessions were
    that Hizballah will not place any signage with Nabih Berri or
    Hassan Nasrallah’s image in these locations and that
    Hizballah will not have a visible presence in these areas.
    BEIRUT 00000372 002.2 OF 004
    (Comment: This is significant. During the July 2006 war,
    Hizballah members moved into Christian areas and started
    converting them to Hizballah strongholds. On one occasion,
    Hizballah attempted to place a Nasrallah banner on the facade
    of a local church. When the inhabitants protested, the were
    intimidated into acquiescing. The banner was later hung
    inside the church. End Comment.) Murr thinks that Hizballah
    agreed to these concessions because it wants to avoid
    internal problems at all costs while it prepares for its
    external fight with Israel. During this same meeting, March
    14 members learned that Hizballah has rockets that can fly
    over 200 kilometers.
    HIZBALLAH NOT CONVINCED THEY CAN WIN
    THEY WILL LOSE IF THEY TRY WAR WITH ISRAEL
    ——————————————
    7. (S) Murr told us that Hizballah is not “internally
    convinced” that it can win this time. It was internally
    convinced that it could win in 2006. Murr predicted that
    Hizballah’s war with Israel will not be like 2006 and that
    the fight in the Beka’a Valley will be very different.
    Saying that Israel paid the price by fighting in the villages
    in 2006, Murr harbors no illusion that they will not get
    bogged down in the village a second time. Instead, Murr
    thinks they will bypass strongholds in villages and pursue
    the main forces, the rockets.
    8. (S) “I am sure Hizballah is scared and they are preparing
    for a severe lesson this time,” Murr said. Hizballah must
    respond to the Mughniya assassination, but they know it will
    bring retribution. Murr thinks that an attack in West Africa
    or South America would be easier for Hizballah but he thinks
    Nasrallah would prefer to attack inside of Israel if
    possible. Hizballah will attempt to bring in Syria to absorb
    some of the Israeli response to their attack, he added.
    SYRIA’S ASSAD SEES NO SIGNALS OF WAR
    THINKS HIS SUMMIT WILL SUCCEED
    ————————————
    9. (S) Murr related that Saudi journalist Ghassan Charbel of
    the Al-Hayat newspaper recently returned to Beirut from
    Damascus where he met with Bashar Al-Assad. Charbel told
    Murr that Bashar Assad told him “I have no Israeli signal of
    a strike or a war even if Hizballah thinks this way.”
    10. (S) Assad feels that his Arab Summit will happen and that
    he can continue to pursue his agenda in Lebanon, Charbel
    informed Murr. Specifically, he intends to push for the
    10-10-10 Cabinet formula while waiting for the term of the
    Bush Administration to expire. He does not see anything at
    all happening this year in Lebanon, Charbel had said. Murr
    seemed to think otherwise, reporting that Syria has recalled
    250,000 migrant agricultural workers from Lebanon who also
    serve in the Syrian military reserves.
    UNSCR 1701 AREAS OF LEBANON ARE PROTECTED
    HIZBALLAH WILL NOT FIGHT ON THIS TERRAIN
    —————————————–
    11. (S) Murr said that Hizballah does not want to move inside
    the UNSCR 1701 areas or to provoke any problems with the
    United Nations Interim Force in Lebanon (UNIFIL). However,
    if Israel violates the 1701 battlespace, Hizballah will use
    this opportunity to flood back into this area. If Israel does
    not go into the 1701 area, Hizballah will not enter these
    areas either.
    12. (S) Returning to the theme of a wary Hizballah, Murr told
    us that “they (Hizballah) are scared, terrorized. They know
    the Israelis will not lose again.” Murr thinks that Ehud
    Barak is a very different Minister of Defense than the one
    who tried to win a war using airpower. Additionally,
    Hizballah knows that President Bush is coming to Israel in
    May, so they think that this new war must be completed by
    that time.
    MICHEL AOUN “GOING INSANE”
    ————————–
    BEIRUT 00000372 003.2 OF 004
    13. (S) When asked what role Free Patriotic Movement leader
    Michel Aoun is playing right now, Murr deadpanned that he is
    “going insane.” Retired BG Fouad Ashkar, an Aoun advisor
    dating to Aoun’s time as Lebanese Army Commander, came to see
    Murr on March 9 to discuss weapons permits for Aoun’s
    bodyguards. Murr told Ashkar that he was authorized only ten
    permits. Aoun had recently contacted Murr’s father to try and
    pressure the MinDef into agreeing to fifty weapons permits.
    A defiant Murr told Ashkar to “go get some of your Hizballah
    suicide bombers to serve as bodyguards,” the sub-context
    being that perhaps Michel Aoun would get blown up along the
    way.
    14. (S) Murr is also limiting the number of visitors that can
    drive up to Aoun’s house in the protected enclave of Rabieh.
    Murr only allows official visitors such as MPs to approach
    the house; all the others must park outside and ride
    shuttles. Murr says that the residents of Rabieh are
    exhausted with Aoun being a bad neighbor and going against
    Christian traditions by backing Hizballah.
    15. (S) Indeed, Murr assesses that Aoun is “going insane.” He
    is increasingly responding to the demands of Ghassan Gebril
    and his daughters, no matter how outlandish the ideas. He is
    allergic to any mention of Army Commander General Michel
    Sleiman and cannot accept a Sleiman Presidency; all this,
    while taking up to five insulin shots a day to try and
    control his increasingly severe diabetes.
    ENTER “THE PRESIDIUM”;
    CONVINCING THE PATRIARCH
    ————————
    16. (S) The idea of a more permanent arrangement where the
    Cabinet exercises more of its executive (Presidential)
    authorities is being discussed. Some have even dubbed this
    arrangement a “Presidium” since the Cabinet would move to
    exercise full Presidential prerogatives. Murr thinks that
    the Maronite Patriarch will be reluctant to accept this idea
    as it will effectively terminate the existence of the
    Presidency to some indeterminate time in the future. Even so,
    some leaders intend to address this subject with the
    Patriarch in order to revive some government functions that
    are lying dormant.
    17. (S) Murr expressed skepticism about this concept, saying
    leaders such as Amine Gemayel and Saad Hariri will use this
    to elevate “stupid” people so that their own political light
    is not obscured or risk being dimmed by another rising
    politician. They are looking at this from their selfish
    parochial views, an approach not uncommon in Lebanese
    politics, Murr complained.
    BUT ISRAEL IS STILL MY MAIN CONCERN;
    OVERFLIGHTS THE MOST SINCE 1982
    ————————————
    18. (S) Making clear that he was not responsible for passing
    messages to Israel, Murr told us that Israel would do well to
    avoid two things when it comes for Hizballah One, it must not
    touch the Blue Line or the UNSCR 1701 areas as this will keep
    Hizballah out of these areas. Two, Israel cannot bomb bridges
    and infrastructure in the Christian areas. The Christians
    were supporting Israel in 2006 until they started bombing
    their bridges. If Israel has to bomb all of these places in
    the Shia areas as a matter of operational concern, that is
    Hizballah’s problem. According to Murr, this war is not with
    Lebanon, it is will Hizballah. Murr also told us that the
    number of overflights recently (reftel B and C) are the
    highest number since 1982. The last time there were this many
    overflights was just prior to Israel invading south Lebanon
    in April 1982, he stated flatly.
    IT’S NOT OUR WAR
    WE HAVE TO PRESERVE THE ARMY
    —————————-
    19. (S) Murr said that he had summoned LAF Commander General
    Sleiman to discuss preparations for a Hizballah conflict with
    BEIRUT 00000372 004.2 OF 004
    Israel on March 7. Murr was especially concerned for members
    of the 1st and 8th Brigades in the Beka’a valley. Murr thinks
    that these units will be cut off from LAF HQ support while
    Israel is conducting operations against Hizballah in the
    Beka’a. As such, they will have to turn to the local
    populace for food, water etc. Since the populace is mainly
    Hizballah supporters, Murr is afraid that these two units
    could be dragged into the fight, the ultimate disaster that
    Murr hopes to avoid. As such, Murr is trying to ascertain
    how long an offensive would be required to clean out
    Hizballah in the Beka’a. The LAF will move to pre-position
    food, money, and water with these units so they can stay on
    their bases when Israel comes for Hizballah–discreetly, Murr
    added.
    20. (S) Murr also gave guidance to Sleiman that the LAF
    should not get involved “when Israel comes.” This guidance
    came four days after Sleiman had instructed his officers to
    be prepared (ref D). Murr told us that he promised Sleiman
    the political cover for LAF inaction. Murr’s opinion is that
    an Israeli action against Hizballah would not be a war
    against Lebanon and that Syria and Iran did not ask Lebanon’s
    permission to equip Hizballah with its rockets. As such, the
    LAF has been ordered to not get involved with any fighting
    and to fulfill a civil defense role, such as humanitarian
    support, when/if hostilities break out. Murr told us that he
    would personally speak to the Shia officers in the Army to
    make sure they understood why the Army was not going to
    participate. For Murr, the LAF’s strategic objective was to
    survive a three week war “completely intact” and able to take
    over once Hizballah’s militia has been destroyed. “I do not
    want thousands of our soldiers to die for no reason,” Murr
    declared.
    COMMENT
    ——-

    1. Leborigine Avatar
      Leborigine

      My apologies Prophet, I have read the whole thing a few times, but I cannot see anything wrong with what Murr has done unless I have missed something?

      1. PROPHET.T Avatar

        Leb, If you don’t see any thing wrong with a defense minister making this statement I don’t know what to think….I’ll explain to you what I think is wrong with his statement.This is what he said:“Murr told us that Israel would do well toavoid two things when it comes for Hizballah One, it must nottouch the Blue Line or the UNSCR 1701 areas as this will keepHizballah out of these areas. Israel cannot bomb bridgesand infrastructure in the Christian areas. The Christianswere supporting Israel in 2006 until they started bombingtheir bridges. If Israel has to bomb all of these places inthe Shiia areas as a matter of operational concern, that isHizballah’s problem. According to Murr, this war is not withLebanon, it is will Hizballah.” “Murr also gave guidance to Suleiman that the LAFshould not get involved “when Israel comes.” This guidancecame four days after Suleiman had instructed his officers tobe prepared (ref D)”“Murr told us that hewould personally speak to the Shia officers in the Army tomake sure they understood why the Army was not going toparticipate. For Murr, the LAF’s strategic objective was tosurvive a three week war “completely intact” and able to takeover once Hizballah’s militia has been destroyed. “I do notwant thousands of our soldiers to die for no reason,” Murrdeclared.”Here you have your own defense minister saying that It’s ok for Israel to bomb brigades in shiia area(operational concern), But it is not ok to bomb bridges and infrastructures in Christian areas. He’s passing a massage there. Don’t you think His statements, that Christians were supporting Israel in 2006 is wrong? What makes him qualified to speak on behalf of the Christians. Do you agree that Christians were supporting Israel?I know that the majority of the Lebanese Christians are very patriotic and would not side with Israel against their own countrymen. I think Lebanese Christians are obligated to respond to Murr’s statement before anyone else. He’s implying that Christians of Lebanon are not patriotic, to put it nicely. I don’t agree with him on this. He is the unpatriotic, and the coward.Who said that Israel’s war is only with HA? Do you believe that? Just go back in history and look at Israel’s Wars and policies,, you would realize that Israel only cares about its own interests. It does not gives a damn about Christians or Muslims or even Americans. If Israel really cared so much about Christians and Christianity , why did all the Christians who live in Israel are moving out to the west? Why making Jerusalem a Jewish city when it is a city for all three religions?If one follows Murr’s logic , you’d have to believe that Palestinians are shiia ( not Sunnis),and Israel’s enemies are not Muslims or Arabs or Christians, but Shiia,and only Shiia. Murr was instructing Suleiman (Army commander) not to get involved if Israel invades. Why do we have a national army? This is the guy( Murr) who drinks and eats ‘ sovereignty” NOW HE IS INSTRUCTING HIS OWN ARMY COMENDORE NOT TO DEFEND THE NATION IF ISRAEL ATTACKS. You explain this to me now. You explain it to the HA supporters, and to the shiia of Lebanon. You ask them to give up their weapons now. Who are they going to count on? Mr. Murr? I’m not sure how much faith these people should have in a defense Minster like Mr. Murr, who thinks that their blood is cheaper than the blood of other Lebanese, and the infrastructure in their areas is not as important as the rest of the country.Your own defense Minster says he was going to explain to shiia officers why the army won’t get involved when Israel attacks. Our army now became “shiia officers” , “Druze officers” ,”Sunni officers” and “Christian officers”. Is this army you want? Is this a person qualified to be defense minister in charge of protecting the nation? So much for the confidence he wants people to have in a national strategy to defend the nation.No where in this cable did he say or instruct His listeners to keep this discussion confidential, He did say that he was not sending a message to Israel , but He never said not share this info with anyone else. It is clear that he was sending an indirect message to Israel that ‘the army won’t get involved if you invade,as long as you bomb shiia area’.The cable instructs state department to share with others.READ ABOVE;(DEPT PASS TO EU MEMBER STATES COLLECTIVE),There is no dount that the US would have passed on th e message to Israel.This will enforce the belief that many Shiia has, that state and the army will never defend them. The army, after all, takes orders from the political authority. I’m not doubting the army’s commitment to defend the nation, But I’m doubting the political commitment of the government, and the personal commitment of Mr Murr.The army has proven over and over that when they are given orders, they put their heart into it,and pay the price to execute orders. The army have made many scarifies to have some one like Mr.Murr lead it. If he has any integrity , He should resign. There should be an investigation to find out where he got this authority from. Is this a secret government policy? Lebanese need to find out.

        1. Leborigine Avatar
          Leborigine

          My apologies, I missed that part altogether. HOW CONVENIENT!!!???

          I totally agree, as a Minister in the government, he should be representing all , and I mean ALL THE LEBANESE people, not just one sect.

          After reading the whole thing again, I must admit there is a lot of correspondence between HA and the government. If all this is true. This is much more complicated than what we really think.

        2. Leborigine Avatar
          Leborigine

          My apologies, I missed that part altogether. HOW CONVENIENT!!!???

          I totally agree, as a Minister in the government, he should be representing all , and I mean ALL THE LEBANESE people, not just one sect.

          After reading the whole thing again, I must admit there is a lot of correspondence between HA and the government. If all this is true. This is much more complicated than what we really think.

    2. Hannibal Avatar

      “Murr also outlined his orders to the Lebanese Army when/if Israel invades to counter Hizballah.” anno ye3ne ma3quul? bala mokh hayda? If the army stands by Hizballah may be this is enough reason for HA to trust and eventually integrate within the army.

      1. PROPHET.T Avatar

        The strangest thing about this cable is that the defense Minster of Lebanon is the one informing the United States that an Israeli attack is imminent. Is this guy an idiot or just arrogant? Or, both? Doesn’t he know that Israel would not attack Lebanon without the United States approval?? would not he think that if an attack is imminent , the us embassy would know before him?I think Sison was laughing when she heard this, but was pleased to hear the rest , that our defense minister was on broad in case Israel decided to attack.

  2. PROPHET.T Avatar

    The great minister of defense of the state of Lebanon with his great strategy to defend the nation against Israel’s expected attack.Well exposed.what a shame….

    Full Document
    VZCZCXRO1782
    OO RUEHBC RUEHDE RUEHKUK RUEHROV
    DE RUEHLB #0372/01 0711608
    ZNY SSSSS ZZH
    O 111608Z MAR 08
    FM AMEMBASSY BEIRUT
    TO RUEHC/SECSTATE WASHDC IMMEDIATE 1273
    INFO RUEHEE/ARAB LEAGUE COLLECTIVE PRIORITY
    RUEHROV/AMEMBASSY VATICAN PRIORITY 1112
    RUEKJCS/SECDEF WASHDC PRIORITY
    RHMFISS/HQ USEUCOM VAIHINGEN GE PRIORITY
    RUCNDT/USMISSION USUN NEW YORK PRIORITY 2041
    RUEHNO/USMISSION USNATO PRIORITY 2308
    RHEHNSC/NSC WASHDC PRIORITY
    RHMFISS/CDR USCENTCOM MACDILL AFB FL PRIORITY
    Content
    S E C R E T SECTION 01 OF 04 BEIRUT 000372
    SIPDIS
    NOFORN
    SIPDIS
    DEPT PASS TO EU MEMBER STATES COLLECTIVE
    NSC FOR ABRAMS/SINGH/YERGER
    E.O. 12958: DECL: 03/10/2018
    TAGS: PGOV, PREL, PTER, PARM, PINR, SY, IS, LE
    SUBJECT: LEBANON: MINDEF WORRIED THAT HIZBALLAH WAR WITH
    ISRAEL IMMINENT
    REF: A. BEIRUT 355
    B. IIR 6 857 0185 08
    C. IIR 6 857 0189 08
    D. BEIRUT 324
    BEIRUT 00000372 001.2 OF 004
    Classified By: Charge D’Affaires a.i. Michele J. Sison
    for reasons 1.4 (b) and (d).
    SUMMARY
    ——-
    1. (S) In a March 10 meeting with Charge, MinDef Murr
    expressed his growing concern that a Hizballah war with
    Israel is imminent. His assessment is based upon recent
    Hizballah preparations, reported movement of families, and
    the precipitous increase in Israeli overflights of Lebanon.
    Murr does not think that Hizballah can win another war with
    Israel and will be defeated. Describing Hizballah as
    “scared,” Murr opined that they are scared because they know
    that Israel might be about to attack, or, more probably, they
    fear the retribution Israel will heap upon them when
    Hizballah takes revenge for the killing of terrorist Imad
    Mughniya. Murr offered some ideas aimed at avoiding turning
    the Christian population against Israel when the next war
    with Hizballah occurs. Murr also outlined his orders to the
    Lebanese Army when/if Israel invades to counter Hizballah.
    End summary.
    2. (S) Charge, Defense Attache and ODC Chief met with Deputy
    Prime Minister and Minister of Defense Elias Murr on March 10
    at his home in Rabieh. The atmosphere of the meeting was
    cordial and friendly.
    HIZBALLAH MEMBERS RENTING SUMMER HOMES;
    NOT ALL REPORTED ACTIVITY
    DIRECTLY RELATED TO WAR PLANNING
    —————————————
    3. (S) Contacts such as Amine Gemayel (ref A) and Walid
    Jumblatt have been telling us recently that the Shia, and in
    particular senior Hizballah members, have been acquiring land
    or renting homes in the Christian areas of Jezzine, Jebel
    Rihan, Junieh, Zahle as well as in Druze areas. This is
    causing alarm among the Christian populations in these
    locations and is being taken as a sign by some that Hizballah
    is planning for war.
    4. (S) MinDef Murr told us that he has looked into these
    rumors and, indeed, it was impossible to find a rental
    property in these areas. Regarding the activity in Jezzine,
    Murr assured us that this was nothing more than investing in
    Lebanon by Lebanese Shia expats based in West Africa. As for
    the buying of Christian properties, Murr reported that the
    Christians want to sell their property so they can leave
    Lebanon. In any case, Murr did not see a military linkage
    between the sale of homes in Jezzine and Hizballah planning.
    5. (S) As for the areas further north in Lebanon such as
    Keserwan and the Metn, Murr confirmed that Shia are renting
    in high numbers there because they feel that Israel is going
    to attack soon. Such action could take place as early as
    April 2008, he warned. (Comment: Shia took refuge
    throughout Christian areas in south Lebanon during the July
    2006 war, with as many as 300-400 people crowded into a
    single church for weeks on end. End Comment.) Murr also told
    us that Hassan Nasrallah’s cousin has moved his family out of
    the southern suburbs, the Dahiyya, and rented a chalet in the
    resort town of Farayya for a year. According to Murr, this
    means that Nasrallah is on high alert.
    6. (S) In addition to renting homes in these areas, Hizballah
    is making many concessions to the Christians who live in
    these areas. In a meeting three weeks ago between top
    Hizballah officials such as Wafiq Safa and March 14 members
    at MoD Headquarters in Yarze, Hizballah agreed to all of the
    Christians demands. The two most notable concessions were
    that Hizballah will not place any signage with Nabih Berri or
    Hassan Nasrallah’s image in these locations and that
    Hizballah will not have a visible presence in these areas.
    BEIRUT 00000372 002.2 OF 004
    (Comment: This is significant. During the July 2006 war,
    Hizballah members moved into Christian areas and started
    converting them to Hizballah strongholds. On one occasion,
    Hizballah attempted to place a Nasrallah banner on the facade
    of a local church. When the inhabitants protested, the were
    intimidated into acquiescing. The banner was later hung
    inside the church. End Comment.) Murr thinks that Hizballah
    agreed to these concessions because it wants to avoid
    internal problems at all costs while it prepares for its
    external fight with Israel. During this same meeting, March
    14 members learned that Hizballah has rockets that can fly
    over 200 kilometers.
    HIZBALLAH NOT CONVINCED THEY CAN WIN
    THEY WILL LOSE IF THEY TRY WAR WITH ISRAEL
    ——————————————
    7. (S) Murr told us that Hizballah is not “internally
    convinced” that it can win this time. It was internally
    convinced that it could win in 2006. Murr predicted that
    Hizballah’s war with Israel will not be like 2006 and that
    the fight in the Beka’a Valley will be very different.
    Saying that Israel paid the price by fighting in the villages
    in 2006, Murr harbors no illusion that they will not get
    bogged down in the village a second time. Instead, Murr
    thinks they will bypass strongholds in villages and pursue
    the main forces, the rockets.
    8. (S) “I am sure Hizballah is scared and they are preparing
    for a severe lesson this time,” Murr said. Hizballah must
    respond to the Mughniya assassination, but they know it will
    bring retribution. Murr thinks that an attack in West Africa
    or South America would be easier for Hizballah but he thinks
    Nasrallah would prefer to attack inside of Israel if
    possible. Hizballah will attempt to bring in Syria to absorb
    some of the Israeli response to their attack, he added.
    SYRIA’S ASSAD SEES NO SIGNALS OF WAR
    THINKS HIS SUMMIT WILL SUCCEED
    ————————————
    9. (S) Murr related that Saudi journalist Ghassan Charbel of
    the Al-Hayat newspaper recently returned to Beirut from
    Damascus where he met with Bashar Al-Assad. Charbel told
    Murr that Bashar Assad told him “I have no Israeli signal of
    a strike or a war even if Hizballah thinks this way.”
    10. (S) Assad feels that his Arab Summit will happen and that
    he can continue to pursue his agenda in Lebanon, Charbel
    informed Murr. Specifically, he intends to push for the
    10-10-10 Cabinet formula while waiting for the term of the
    Bush Administration to expire. He does not see anything at
    all happening this year in Lebanon, Charbel had said. Murr
    seemed to think otherwise, reporting that Syria has recalled
    250,000 migrant agricultural workers from Lebanon who also
    serve in the Syrian military reserves.
    UNSCR 1701 AREAS OF LEBANON ARE PROTECTED
    HIZBALLAH WILL NOT FIGHT ON THIS TERRAIN
    —————————————–
    11. (S) Murr said that Hizballah does not want to move inside
    the UNSCR 1701 areas or to provoke any problems with the
    United Nations Interim Force in Lebanon (UNIFIL). However,
    if Israel violates the 1701 battlespace, Hizballah will use
    this opportunity to flood back into this area. If Israel does
    not go into the 1701 area, Hizballah will not enter these
    areas either.
    12. (S) Returning to the theme of a wary Hizballah, Murr told
    us that “they (Hizballah) are scared, terrorized. They know
    the Israelis will not lose again.” Murr thinks that Ehud
    Barak is a very different Minister of Defense than the one
    who tried to win a war using airpower. Additionally,
    Hizballah knows that President Bush is coming to Israel in
    May, so they think that this new war must be completed by
    that time.
    MICHEL AOUN “GOING INSANE”
    ————————–
    BEIRUT 00000372 003.2 OF 004
    13. (S) When asked what role Free Patriotic Movement leader
    Michel Aoun is playing right now, Murr deadpanned that he is
    “going insane.” Retired BG Fouad Ashkar, an Aoun advisor
    dating to Aoun’s time as Lebanese Army Commander, came to see
    Murr on March 9 to discuss weapons permits for Aoun’s
    bodyguards. Murr told Ashkar that he was authorized only ten
    permits. Aoun had recently contacted Murr’s father to try and
    pressure the MinDef into agreeing to fifty weapons permits.
    A defiant Murr told Ashkar to “go get some of your Hizballah
    suicide bombers to serve as bodyguards,” the sub-context
    being that perhaps Michel Aoun would get blown up along the
    way.
    14. (S) Murr is also limiting the number of visitors that can
    drive up to Aoun’s house in the protected enclave of Rabieh.
    Murr only allows official visitors such as MPs to approach
    the house; all the others must park outside and ride
    shuttles. Murr says that the residents of Rabieh are
    exhausted with Aoun being a bad neighbor and going against
    Christian traditions by backing Hizballah.
    15. (S) Indeed, Murr assesses that Aoun is “going insane.” He
    is increasingly responding to the demands of Ghassan Gebril
    and his daughters, no matter how outlandish the ideas. He is
    allergic to any mention of Army Commander General Michel
    Sleiman and cannot accept a Sleiman Presidency; all this,
    while taking up to five insulin shots a day to try and
    control his increasingly severe diabetes.
    ENTER “THE PRESIDIUM”;
    CONVINCING THE PATRIARCH
    ————————
    16. (S) The idea of a more permanent arrangement where the
    Cabinet exercises more of its executive (Presidential)
    authorities is being discussed. Some have even dubbed this
    arrangement a “Presidium” since the Cabinet would move to
    exercise full Presidential prerogatives. Murr thinks that
    the Maronite Patriarch will be reluctant to accept this idea
    as it will effectively terminate the existence of the
    Presidency to some indeterminate time in the future. Even so,
    some leaders intend to address this subject with the
    Patriarch in order to revive some government functions that
    are lying dormant.
    17. (S) Murr expressed skepticism about this concept, saying
    leaders such as Amine Gemayel and Saad Hariri will use this
    to elevate “stupid” people so that their own political light
    is not obscured or risk being dimmed by another rising
    politician. They are looking at this from their selfish
    parochial views, an approach not uncommon in Lebanese
    politics, Murr complained.
    BUT ISRAEL IS STILL MY MAIN CONCERN;
    OVERFLIGHTS THE MOST SINCE 1982
    ————————————
    18. (S) Making clear that he was not responsible for passing
    messages to Israel, Murr told us that Israel would do well to
    avoid two things when it comes for Hizballah One, it must not
    touch the Blue Line or the UNSCR 1701 areas as this will keep
    Hizballah out of these areas. Two, Israel cannot bomb bridges
    and infrastructure in the Christian areas. The Christians
    were supporting Israel in 2006 until they started bombing
    their bridges. If Israel has to bomb all of these places in
    the Shia areas as a matter of operational concern, that is
    Hizballah’s problem. According to Murr, this war is not with
    Lebanon, it is will Hizballah. Murr also told us that the
    number of overflights recently (reftel B and C) are the
    highest number since 1982. The last time there were this many
    overflights was just prior to Israel invading south Lebanon
    in April 1982, he stated flatly.
    IT’S NOT OUR WAR
    WE HAVE TO PRESERVE THE ARMY
    —————————-
    19. (S) Murr said that he had summoned LAF Commander General
    Sleiman to discuss preparations for a Hizballah conflict with
    BEIRUT 00000372 004.2 OF 004
    Israel on March 7. Murr was especially concerned for members
    of the 1st and 8th Brigades in the Beka’a valley. Murr thinks
    that these units will be cut off from LAF HQ support while
    Israel is conducting operations against Hizballah in the
    Beka’a. As such, they will have to turn to the local
    populace for food, water etc. Since the populace is mainly
    Hizballah supporters, Murr is afraid that these two units
    could be dragged into the fight, the ultimate disaster that
    Murr hopes to avoid. As such, Murr is trying to ascertain
    how long an offensive would be required to clean out
    Hizballah in the Beka’a. The LAF will move to pre-position
    food, money, and water with these units so they can stay on
    their bases when Israel comes for Hizballah–discreetly, Murr
    added.
    20. (S) Murr also gave guidance to Sleiman that the LAF
    should not get involved “when Israel comes.” This guidance
    came four days after Sleiman had instructed his officers to
    be prepared (ref D). Murr told us that he promised Sleiman
    the political cover for LAF inaction. Murr’s opinion is that
    an Israeli action against Hizballah would not be a war
    against Lebanon and that Syria and Iran did not ask Lebanon’s
    permission to equip Hizballah with its rockets. As such, the
    LAF has been ordered to not get involved with any fighting
    and to fulfill a civil defense role, such as humanitarian
    support, when/if hostilities break out. Murr told us that he
    would personally speak to the Shia officers in the Army to
    make sure they understood why the Army was not going to
    participate. For Murr, the LAF’s strategic objective was to
    survive a three week war “completely intact” and able to take
    over once Hizballah’s militia has been destroyed. “I do not
    want thousands of our soldiers to die for no reason,” Murr
    declared.
    COMMENT
    ——-

  3. PROPHET.T Avatar

    The great minister of defense of the state of Lebanon with his great strategy to defend the nation against Israel’s expected attack.Well exposed.what a shame….

    Full Document
    VZCZCXRO1782
    OO RUEHBC RUEHDE RUEHKUK RUEHROV
    DE RUEHLB #0372/01 0711608
    ZNY SSSSS ZZH
    O 111608Z MAR 08
    FM AMEMBASSY BEIRUT
    TO RUEHC/SECSTATE WASHDC IMMEDIATE 1273
    INFO RUEHEE/ARAB LEAGUE COLLECTIVE PRIORITY
    RUEHROV/AMEMBASSY VATICAN PRIORITY 1112
    RUEKJCS/SECDEF WASHDC PRIORITY
    RHMFISS/HQ USEUCOM VAIHINGEN GE PRIORITY
    RUCNDT/USMISSION USUN NEW YORK PRIORITY 2041
    RUEHNO/USMISSION USNATO PRIORITY 2308
    RHEHNSC/NSC WASHDC PRIORITY
    RHMFISS/CDR USCENTCOM MACDILL AFB FL PRIORITY
    Content
    S E C R E T SECTION 01 OF 04 BEIRUT 000372
    SIPDIS
    NOFORN
    SIPDIS
    DEPT PASS TO EU MEMBER STATES COLLECTIVE
    NSC FOR ABRAMS/SINGH/YERGER
    E.O. 12958: DECL: 03/10/2018
    TAGS: PGOV, PREL, PTER, PARM, PINR, SY, IS, LE
    SUBJECT: LEBANON: MINDEF WORRIED THAT HIZBALLAH WAR WITH
    ISRAEL IMMINENT
    REF: A. BEIRUT 355
    B. IIR 6 857 0185 08
    C. IIR 6 857 0189 08
    D. BEIRUT 324
    BEIRUT 00000372 001.2 OF 004
    Classified By: Charge D’Affaires a.i. Michele J. Sison
    for reasons 1.4 (b) and (d).
    SUMMARY
    ——-
    1. (S) In a March 10 meeting with Charge, MinDef Murr
    expressed his growing concern that a Hizballah war with
    Israel is imminent. His assessment is based upon recent
    Hizballah preparations, reported movement of families, and
    the precipitous increase in Israeli overflights of Lebanon.
    Murr does not think that Hizballah can win another war with
    Israel and will be defeated. Describing Hizballah as
    “scared,” Murr opined that they are scared because they know
    that Israel might be about to attack, or, more probably, they
    fear the retribution Israel will heap upon them when
    Hizballah takes revenge for the killing of terrorist Imad
    Mughniya. Murr offered some ideas aimed at avoiding turning
    the Christian population against Israel when the next war
    with Hizballah occurs. Murr also outlined his orders to the
    Lebanese Army when/if Israel invades to counter Hizballah.
    End summary.
    2. (S) Charge, Defense Attache and ODC Chief met with Deputy
    Prime Minister and Minister of Defense Elias Murr on March 10
    at his home in Rabieh. The atmosphere of the meeting was
    cordial and friendly.
    HIZBALLAH MEMBERS RENTING SUMMER HOMES;
    NOT ALL REPORTED ACTIVITY
    DIRECTLY RELATED TO WAR PLANNING
    —————————————
    3. (S) Contacts such as Amine Gemayel (ref A) and Walid
    Jumblatt have been telling us recently that the Shia, and in
    particular senior Hizballah members, have been acquiring land
    or renting homes in the Christian areas of Jezzine, Jebel
    Rihan, Junieh, Zahle as well as in Druze areas. This is
    causing alarm among the Christian populations in these
    locations and is being taken as a sign by some that Hizballah
    is planning for war.
    4. (S) MinDef Murr told us that he has looked into these
    rumors and, indeed, it was impossible to find a rental
    property in these areas. Regarding the activity in Jezzine,
    Murr assured us that this was nothing more than investing in
    Lebanon by Lebanese Shia expats based in West Africa. As for
    the buying of Christian properties, Murr reported that the
    Christians want to sell their property so they can leave
    Lebanon. In any case, Murr did not see a military linkage
    between the sale of homes in Jezzine and Hizballah planning.
    5. (S) As for the areas further north in Lebanon such as
    Keserwan and the Metn, Murr confirmed that Shia are renting
    in high numbers there because they feel that Israel is going
    to attack soon. Such action could take place as early as
    April 2008, he warned. (Comment: Shia took refuge
    throughout Christian areas in south Lebanon during the July
    2006 war, with as many as 300-400 people crowded into a
    single church for weeks on end. End Comment.) Murr also told
    us that Hassan Nasrallah’s cousin has moved his family out of
    the southern suburbs, the Dahiyya, and rented a chalet in the
    resort town of Farayya for a year. According to Murr, this
    means that Nasrallah is on high alert.
    6. (S) In addition to renting homes in these areas, Hizballah
    is making many concessions to the Christians who live in
    these areas. In a meeting three weeks ago between top
    Hizballah officials such as Wafiq Safa and March 14 members
    at MoD Headquarters in Yarze, Hizballah agreed to all of the
    Christians demands. The two most notable concessions were
    that Hizballah will not place any signage with Nabih Berri or
    Hassan Nasrallah’s image in these locations and that
    Hizballah will not have a visible presence in these areas.
    BEIRUT 00000372 002.2 OF 004
    (Comment: This is significant. During the July 2006 war,
    Hizballah members moved into Christian areas and started
    converting them to Hizballah strongholds. On one occasion,
    Hizballah attempted to place a Nasrallah banner on the facade
    of a local church. When the inhabitants protested, the were
    intimidated into acquiescing. The banner was later hung
    inside the church. End Comment.) Murr thinks that Hizballah
    agreed to these concessions because it wants to avoid
    internal problems at all costs while it prepares for its
    external fight with Israel. During this same meeting, March
    14 members learned that Hizballah has rockets that can fly
    over 200 kilometers.
    HIZBALLAH NOT CONVINCED THEY CAN WIN
    THEY WILL LOSE IF THEY TRY WAR WITH ISRAEL
    ——————————————
    7. (S) Murr told us that Hizballah is not “internally
    convinced” that it can win this time. It was internally
    convinced that it could win in 2006. Murr predicted that
    Hizballah’s war with Israel will not be like 2006 and that
    the fight in the Beka’a Valley will be very different.
    Saying that Israel paid the price by fighting in the villages
    in 2006, Murr harbors no illusion that they will not get
    bogged down in the village a second time. Instead, Murr
    thinks they will bypass strongholds in villages and pursue
    the main forces, the rockets.
    8. (S) “I am sure Hizballah is scared and they are preparing
    for a severe lesson this time,” Murr said. Hizballah must
    respond to the Mughniya assassination, but they know it will
    bring retribution. Murr thinks that an attack in West Africa
    or South America would be easier for Hizballah but he thinks
    Nasrallah would prefer to attack inside of Israel if
    possible. Hizballah will attempt to bring in Syria to absorb
    some of the Israeli response to their attack, he added.
    SYRIA’S ASSAD SEES NO SIGNALS OF WAR
    THINKS HIS SUMMIT WILL SUCCEED
    ————————————
    9. (S) Murr related that Saudi journalist Ghassan Charbel of
    the Al-Hayat newspaper recently returned to Beirut from
    Damascus where he met with Bashar Al-Assad. Charbel told
    Murr that Bashar Assad told him “I have no Israeli signal of
    a strike or a war even if Hizballah thinks this way.”
    10. (S) Assad feels that his Arab Summit will happen and that
    he can continue to pursue his agenda in Lebanon, Charbel
    informed Murr. Specifically, he intends to push for the
    10-10-10 Cabinet formula while waiting for the term of the
    Bush Administration to expire. He does not see anything at
    all happening this year in Lebanon, Charbel had said. Murr
    seemed to think otherwise, reporting that Syria has recalled
    250,000 migrant agricultural workers from Lebanon who also
    serve in the Syrian military reserves.
    UNSCR 1701 AREAS OF LEBANON ARE PROTECTED
    HIZBALLAH WILL NOT FIGHT ON THIS TERRAIN
    —————————————–
    11. (S) Murr said that Hizballah does not want to move inside
    the UNSCR 1701 areas or to provoke any problems with the
    United Nations Interim Force in Lebanon (UNIFIL). However,
    if Israel violates the 1701 battlespace, Hizballah will use
    this opportunity to flood back into this area. If Israel does
    not go into the 1701 area, Hizballah will not enter these
    areas either.
    12. (S) Returning to the theme of a wary Hizballah, Murr told
    us that “they (Hizballah) are scared, terrorized. They know
    the Israelis will not lose again.” Murr thinks that Ehud
    Barak is a very different Minister of Defense than the one
    who tried to win a war using airpower. Additionally,
    Hizballah knows that President Bush is coming to Israel in
    May, so they think that this new war must be completed by
    that time.
    MICHEL AOUN “GOING INSANE”
    ————————–
    BEIRUT 00000372 003.2 OF 004
    13. (S) When asked what role Free Patriotic Movement leader
    Michel Aoun is playing right now, Murr deadpanned that he is
    “going insane.” Retired BG Fouad Ashkar, an Aoun advisor
    dating to Aoun’s time as Lebanese Army Commander, came to see
    Murr on March 9 to discuss weapons permits for Aoun’s
    bodyguards. Murr told Ashkar that he was authorized only ten
    permits. Aoun had recently contacted Murr’s father to try and
    pressure the MinDef into agreeing to fifty weapons permits.
    A defiant Murr told Ashkar to “go get some of your Hizballah
    suicide bombers to serve as bodyguards,” the sub-context
    being that perhaps Michel Aoun would get blown up along the
    way.
    14. (S) Murr is also limiting the number of visitors that can
    drive up to Aoun’s house in the protected enclave of Rabieh.
    Murr only allows official visitors such as MPs to approach
    the house; all the others must park outside and ride
    shuttles. Murr says that the residents of Rabieh are
    exhausted with Aoun being a bad neighbor and going against
    Christian traditions by backing Hizballah.
    15. (S) Indeed, Murr assesses that Aoun is “going insane.” He
    is increasingly responding to the demands of Ghassan Gebril
    and his daughters, no matter how outlandish the ideas. He is
    allergic to any mention of Army Commander General Michel
    Sleiman and cannot accept a Sleiman Presidency; all this,
    while taking up to five insulin shots a day to try and
    control his increasingly severe diabetes.
    ENTER “THE PRESIDIUM”;
    CONVINCING THE PATRIARCH
    ————————
    16. (S) The idea of a more permanent arrangement where the
    Cabinet exercises more of its executive (Presidential)
    authorities is being discussed. Some have even dubbed this
    arrangement a “Presidium” since the Cabinet would move to
    exercise full Presidential prerogatives. Murr thinks that
    the Maronite Patriarch will be reluctant to accept this idea
    as it will effectively terminate the existence of the
    Presidency to some indeterminate time in the future. Even so,
    some leaders intend to address this subject with the
    Patriarch in order to revive some government functions that
    are lying dormant.
    17. (S) Murr expressed skepticism about this concept, saying
    leaders such as Amine Gemayel and Saad Hariri will use this
    to elevate “stupid” people so that their own political light
    is not obscured or risk being dimmed by another rising
    politician. They are looking at this from their selfish
    parochial views, an approach not uncommon in Lebanese
    politics, Murr complained.
    BUT ISRAEL IS STILL MY MAIN CONCERN;
    OVERFLIGHTS THE MOST SINCE 1982
    ————————————
    18. (S) Making clear that he was not responsible for passing
    messages to Israel, Murr told us that Israel would do well to
    avoid two things when it comes for Hizballah One, it must not
    touch the Blue Line or the UNSCR 1701 areas as this will keep
    Hizballah out of these areas. Two, Israel cannot bomb bridges
    and infrastructure in the Christian areas. The Christians
    were supporting Israel in 2006 until they started bombing
    their bridges. If Israel has to bomb all of these places in
    the Shia areas as a matter of operational concern, that is
    Hizballah’s problem. According to Murr, this war is not with
    Lebanon, it is will Hizballah. Murr also told us that the
    number of overflights recently (reftel B and C) are the
    highest number since 1982. The last time there were this many
    overflights was just prior to Israel invading south Lebanon
    in April 1982, he stated flatly.
    IT’S NOT OUR WAR
    WE HAVE TO PRESERVE THE ARMY
    —————————-
    19. (S) Murr said that he had summoned LAF Commander General
    Sleiman to discuss preparations for a Hizballah conflict with
    BEIRUT 00000372 004.2 OF 004
    Israel on March 7. Murr was especially concerned for members
    of the 1st and 8th Brigades in the Beka’a valley. Murr thinks
    that these units will be cut off from LAF HQ support while
    Israel is conducting operations against Hizballah in the
    Beka’a. As such, they will have to turn to the local
    populace for food, water etc. Since the populace is mainly
    Hizballah supporters, Murr is afraid that these two units
    could be dragged into the fight, the ultimate disaster that
    Murr hopes to avoid. As such, Murr is trying to ascertain
    how long an offensive would be required to clean out
    Hizballah in the Beka’a. The LAF will move to pre-position
    food, money, and water with these units so they can stay on
    their bases when Israel comes for Hizballah–discreetly, Murr
    added.
    20. (S) Murr also gave guidance to Sleiman that the LAF
    should not get involved “when Israel comes.” This guidance
    came four days after Sleiman had instructed his officers to
    be prepared (ref D). Murr told us that he promised Sleiman
    the political cover for LAF inaction. Murr’s opinion is that
    an Israeli action against Hizballah would not be a war
    against Lebanon and that Syria and Iran did not ask Lebanon’s
    permission to equip Hizballah with its rockets. As such, the
    LAF has been ordered to not get involved with any fighting
    and to fulfill a civil defense role, such as humanitarian
    support, when/if hostilities break out. Murr told us that he
    would personally speak to the Shia officers in the Army to
    make sure they understood why the Army was not going to
    participate. For Murr, the LAF’s strategic objective was to
    survive a three week war “completely intact” and able to take
    over once Hizballah’s militia has been destroyed. “I do not
    want thousands of our soldiers to die for no reason,” Murr
    declared.
    COMMENT
    ——-

    1.  Avatar

      My apologies Prophet, I have read the whole thing a few times, but I cannot see anything wrong with what Murr has done unless I have missed something?

      1. PROPHET.T Avatar

        Leb,
        If you don’t see any thing wrong with a defense minister making this statement I don’t know what to think….I’ll explain to you what I think is wrong with his statement.
        This is what he said:
        “Murr told us that Israel would do well to
        avoid two things when it comes for Hizballah One, it must not
        touch the Blue Line or the UNSCR 1701 areas as this will keep
        Hizballah out of these areas.
        Israel cannot bomb bridges
        and infrastructure in the Christian areas. The Christians
        were supporting Israel in 2006 until they started bombing
        their bridges. If Israel has to bomb all of these places in
        the Shiia areas as a matter of operational concern, that is
        Hizballah’s problem. According to Murr, this war is not with
        Lebanon, it is will Hizballah.”
        “Murr also gave guidance to Suleiman that the LAF
        should not get involved “when Israel comes.” This guidance
        came four days after Suleiman had instructed his officers to
        be prepared (ref D)”
        “Murr told us that he
        would personally speak to the Shia officers in the Army to
        make sure they understood why the Army was not going to
        participate. For Murr, the LAF’s strategic objective was to
        survive a three week war “completely intact” and able to take
        over once Hizballah’s militia has been destroyed. “I do not
        want thousands of our soldiers to die for no reason,” Murr
        declared.”

        Here you have your own defense minister saying that It’s ok for Israel to bomb brigades in shiia area, But it is not ok to bomb bridges and infrastructures in Christian areas.
        Don’t you think His statements, that Christians were supporting Israel in 2006 is wrong? What makes him qualified to speak on behalf of the Christians. I know that the majority of the Lebanese Christians are very patriotic and would not side with Israel against their own countrymen. I think Lebanese Christians are obligated to respond to Murr’s statement before anyone else. He’s implying that Christians of Lebanon are not patriotic, to put it nicely. I don’t agree with him on this. He is the unpatriotic, and the coward.
        Who said that Israel’s war is only with HA? Do you believe that?
        Just go back in history and look at Israel’s policy, you would realize that Israel only cares about its own interests. It gives a damn about Christians or Muslims or even Americans. If Israel really cared so much about Christians and Christianity , why did all the Christians who live in Israel are moving out to the west? Why making Jerusalem a Jewish city when it is a city for all three religions?
        Murr was instructing Suleiman (Army commander) not to get involved if Israel invades. Why do we have a national army? This is the guy( Murr) who drinks and eats ‘ sovereignty” NOW HE IS INSTRUCTING HIS OWN ARMY COMENDORE NOT TO DEFEND THE NATION IF ISRAEL ATTACKS. You explain this to me now. You explain it to the HA supporters, and to the shiia of Lebanon. You ask them to give up their weapons now. Who are they going to count on? Mr. Murr? I’m not sure how much faith these people should have in a defense Minster like Mr. Murr, who thinks that their blood is cheaper than the blood of other Lebanese, and the infrastructure in their areas is not as important as the rest of the country.

        Your own defense Minster says he was going to explain to shiia officers why the army won’t get involved when Israel attacks. Our army now became shiia officers and Druze officers and Christian officers, is this army you want? Is this a person qualified to be defense minister in charge of protecting the nation? So much for the confidence he wants people to have in a national strategy to defend the nation.
        No where in this cable he said to the Americans to keep this discussion confidential, He did say that he was not sending a message to Israel , but He never said not share this info with anyone else. It is clear that he was sending an indirect message to Israel that the army won’t get involved if you invade.
        This will enforce the belief that many Shiia has, that state and the army will never defend them. The army, after all, takes order from the political authority. I’m not doubting the army’s commitment to defend the nation, But the political commitment of government, and the personal commitment of Mr Murr. If he has any integrity , He should resign. The should be an investigation to find out where he got this authority from. Is this a secret government policy? We need to find out.

        1.  Avatar

          My apologies, I missed that part altogether. HOW CONVENIENT!!!???

          I totally agree, as a Minister in the government, he should be representing all , and I mean ALL THE LEBANESE people, not just one sect.

          After reading the whole thing again, I must admit there is a lot of correspondence between HA and the government. If all this is true. This is much more complicated than what we really think.

    2. “Murr also outlined his orders to the Lebanese Army when/if Israel invades to counter Hizballah.” anno ye3ne ma3quul? bala mokh hayda? If the army stands by Hizballah may be this is enough reason for HA to trust and eventually integrate within the army.

      1. PROPHET.T Avatar

        The strangest thing about this cable is that the defense Minster of Lebanon is the one informing the United States that an Israeli attack is imminent. Is this guy an idiot or just arrogant? Or, both? Doesn’t he know that Israel would not attack Lebanon without the United States approval?? I think Sison was laughing when she heard this.

  4. master09 Avatar

    Remember HA is not at war with Isreal alone, no it is at war with peace, Lebanon, the Lebanese army, Christians and the Islamic Sunni.The funny thing is people in Lebanon support them WOW my people, the Lebanese who dont want peace in thier own country, HA dont care about Lebanon just one thing to distroy Isreal. Go to Iran or Syria and do what you want there as they are the only supporter of that outcome. I only want peace not war for my country no matter who it is with
    Politics will has always and will always be the same no matter what group you are USA ISREAL OR HA .

  5.  Avatar

    Remember HA is not at war with Isreal alone, no it is at war with peace, Lebanon, the Lebanese army, Christians and the Islamic Sunni.The funny thing is people in Lebanon support them WOW my people, the Lebanese who dont want peace in thier own country, HA dont care about Lebanon just one thing to distroy Isreal. Go to Iran or Syria and do what you want there as they are the only supporter of that outcome. I only want peace not war for my country no matter who it is with

    Politics will has always and will always be the same no matter what group you are USA ISREAL OR HA .

  6. The problem in lebanon is a lack of trust in our instution and goverment. HA is capitalizing on the fact that shia in particular don,t trust the army to help them if Isreal attack the south. How can we then build a strong army without the involment of the shia sect. Prophet what would it take for your shia sect in your opinion to put their trust in our army and institution. In my opinion HA even if the shia trusted fully and completed the gov and army, they would never give up their strong political position because in pratice they don’t need take down the gov they already controling the agenda of the gov trought their veto power and military power. So whatever HA says lebanon bend backward and says yes Hassan. Is this the kind of country nation you want for thr people of lebanon as a patriotic I would imagine you defending our lebanese flag not HEZ

  7. The problem in lebanon is a lack of trust in our instution and goverment. HA is capitalizing on the fact that shia in particular don,t trust the army to help them if Isreal attack the south. How can we then build a strong army without the involment of the shia sect. Prophet what would it take for your shia sect in your opinion to put their trust in our army and institution. In my opinion HA even if the shia trusted fully and completed the gov and army, they would never give up their strong political position because in pratice they don’t need take down the gov they already controling the agenda of the gov trought their veto power and military power. So whatever HA says lebanon bend backward and says yes Hassan. Is this the kind of country nation you want for thr people of lebanon as a patriotic I would imagine you defending our lebanese flag not HEZ

    1. PROPHET.T Avatar

      Marc,
      I don’t know what it will take for shiia to trust that the state will defend them, But these secret thinkings of our defense minister do not help at all.
      Minster Murr revealed statements gave many reasons for those Shiia who don’t have much faith in the state, to be more suspicious.I personally believed that the army would fight hand in hand with the resistance and the rest of Lebanese to defend against any Israeli invasion.Now? I’m not sure.
      But My own personal views may not be the same as the collective thinking of shiaa in Lebanon.
      Shiia are part of the Army and other security institutions. They believe in the Army and all Lebanese forces, I truly believe that the Army and the government have made a big progress in the effort of building an army with the mentality of national defense, But the revealed thinking of Murr raises some serious questions.
      There is a wide spread suspicions that the state lacks the political will to use the army as a national defense army, and a clear understanding that it is not strong enough to do the job. It is a well known secret that the state does not have enough money to buy weapons, and if they did, the veto by the US, and the Europeans to arm the Lebanese army prevents them from acquiring effective weapons.
      The statements revealed a secret policy by the defense department that He is not willing to use its army to defend the state .In fact it reveals a way of thinking by Murr that He’d wait for the enemy to destroy the resistance ,and all of the infrastructures in the its area of influence( shiia area), so He can send the army to take control. I doubt that this a national policy. I think the government and the president have a responsibility to clarify the state policy.

  8. all of you need to zip it about why dont the shia trust the state, first of all, if not for them there would be no state. second of all, they did not sell themselves to saudi as hariri did, or to the west like the maronites did. third of all, the army has plently of shia, do you all know absolutely nothing about the LAF? the LAF wants the resistance to remain, the LAF cooperates and collaborates with the resistance, people who support the resistance also are in the LAF.
    i love how you pick on the one group of people who actually did something for the country unlike the majority of the rest

    1. Leborigine Avatar
      Leborigine

      No, they sold themselves to syria and iran instead.
      Sometimes I really wished that syria did stay in Lebanon, so people like you can enjoy their hegemony, freedom of speech and the posters of their leaders in your front yard.

      1. oh no your collaboration with zionist pigs was much better situation right?

        1. Leborigine Avatar
          Leborigine

          I knew you would come back with that!! So if I do not support the syrians screwing us then I am a zionist. Well Lela, good luck to you. If you want Lebanon to be like syria and want us to bend over for them anytime they want us too, then I hope your wish comes true and to every Lebanese who desires that. Just for the record, as much as HA is defending Lebanon from israel, we have to defend it from syria, iran, turkey and everyone else who wants a piece of us!!

        2. Hannibal Avatar

          Lela,
          You stoop so low… Even if one out of anger speaks against HA because of their stealing the decision of war and peace via their weapons, it is also blindly stupid for anyone to deny their sacrifices to the nation. However, to label entire sects as Zionist pigs collaborators after their sacrifices is not becoming. I know you are on the defensive but it does not gain you allies by saying for instance Maronites did not contribute to this nation. My father, both grandfathers, and uncles were in the LAF and fought Israel since its inception and although I am areligious I won’t be happy seeing their deeds labeled as Zionist collaborators. It is JUST UNFAIR. Also, the same way you see the Shia who fell in the face of the Zionist usurper as heroes, the Maronites or Christians see the men and women who fell defending Lebanon against the Kissinger project in Ain el Remmeene as heroes as well. My problem with HA is two fold. First its label as Shia Islamic Resistance since I am secular, and that like the PLO (notice I did not say Palestinians) before them they need a GPS to redirect them South… 😉 Anyways, if one would read inside the lines of what Prophet generously has been posting from the wikileaks, we can deduct that we are a fragmented nation and that our leaders don’t give a damn about nada. I mean how on Earth one can read the wikileaks without being angry. Mr. Murr speaks as if the army belongs to his dad. This is not a state, this is not even a failed state, this is at best a farm, with chickens and pigs. What a shame.

      2. master09 Avatar

        On the mark 100% because my people would rather have someone in control of thier life like HA, Syria and Iran rather than peace and freedom for Lebanon. The Lebanese look more outside thier backyard instead of fixing the problems we have in Lebanon.

    2. Leborigine Avatar
      Leborigine

      No, they sold themselves to syria and iran instead.
      Sometimes I really wished that syria did stay in Lebanon, so people like you can enjoy their hegemony, freedom of speech and the posters of their leaders in your front yard.

      1. oh no your collaboration with zionist pigs was much better situation right?

        1. Leborigine Avatar
          Leborigine

          I knew you would come back with that!! So if I do not support the syrians screwing us then I am a zionist. Well Lela, good luck to you. If you want Lebanon to be like syria and want us to bend over for them anytime they want us too, then I hope your wish comes true and to every Lebanese who desires that. Just for the record, as much as HA is defending Lebanon from israel, we have to defend it from syria, iran, turkey and everyone else who wants a piece of us!!

  9. all of you need to zip it about why dont the shia trust the state, first of all, if not for them there would be no state. second of all, they did not sell themselves to saudi as hariri did, or to the west like the maronites did. third of all, the army has plently of shia, do you all know absolutely nothing about the LAF? the LAF wants the resistance to remain, the LAF cooperates and collaborates with the resistance, people who support the resistance also are in the LAF.

    i love how you pick on the one group of people who actually did something for the country unlike the majority of the rest

    1.  Avatar

      No, they sold themselves to syria and iran instead.

      Sometimes I really wished that syria did stay in Lebanon, so people like you can enjoy their hegemony, freedom of speech and the posters of their leaders in your front yard.

      1. oh no your collaboration with zionist pigs was much better situation right?

        1.  Avatar

          I knew you would come back with that!! So if I do not support the syrians screwing us then I am a zionist. Well Lela, good luck to you. If you want Lebanon to be like syria and want us to bend over for them anytime they want us too, then I hope your wish comes true and to every Lebanese who desires that. Just for the record, as much as HA is defending Lebanon from israel, we have to defend it from syria, iran, turkey and everyone else who wants a piece of us!!

        2. Lela,
          You stoop so low… Even if one out of anger speaks against HA because of their stealing the decision of war and peace via their weapons, it is also blindly stupid for anyone to deny their sacrifices to the nation. However, to label entire sects as Zionist pigs collaborators after their sacrifices is not becoming. I know you are on the defensive but it does not gain you allies by saying for instance Maronites did not contribute to this nation. My father, both grandfathers, and uncles were in the LAF and fought Israel since its inception and although I am areligious I won’t be happy seeing their deeds labeled as Zionist collaborators. It is JUST UNFAIR. Also, the same way you see the Shia who fell in the face of the Zionist usurper as heroes, the Maronites or Christians see the men and women who fell defending Lebanon against the Kissinger project in Ain el Remmeene as heroes as well. My problem with HA is two fold. First its label as Shia Islamic Resistance since I am secular, and that like the PLO (notice I did not say Palestinians) before them they need a GPS to redirect them South… 😉 Anyways, if one would read inside the lines of what Prophet generously has been posting from the wikileaks, we can deduct that we are a fragmented nation and that our leaders don’t give a damn about nada. I mean how on Earth one can read the wikileaks without being angry. Mr. Murr speaks as if the army belongs to his dad. This is not a state, this is not even a failed state, this is at best a farm, with chickens and pigs. What a shame.

      2.  Avatar

        On the mark 100% because my people would rather have someone in control of thier life like HA, Syria and Iran rather than peace and freedom for Lebanon. The Lebanese look more outside thier backyard instead of fixing the problems we have in Lebanon.

  10. master09 Avatar

    Good work Murr we do not want war with any country just the destruction of HA and peace for Lebanon and its people. The army should not get involved but should help rid this evil from our country.This group dont care for Lebanon or its people or peace and if anyone thinks otherwise than you are evil and will not look or listen to anyone but what comes out of your mouth be right or wrong.Get guns out of peoples hand and let the army do its work HA is a street gang nothing more nothing less.Look at the leader of HA can he show his face in public now that is a crim.

  11.  Avatar

    Good work Murr we do not want war with any country just the destruction of HA and peace for Lebanon and its people. The army should not get involved but should help rid this evil from our country.This group dont care for Lebanon or its people or peace and if anyone thinks otherwise than you are evil and will not look or listen to anyone but what comes out of your mouth be right or wrong.Get guns out of peoples hand and let the army do its work HA is a street gang nothing more nothing less.Look at the leader of HA can he show his face in public now that is a crim.

  12. master09 Avatar

    No Lebanese want war only HA . No political party want war with Isreal but when HA Syria and Iran have guns on the heads of these Lebanese people what chose do they have. Remember the days of car bombs when someone said a word or spoke out about HA Syria OR Iran. BANG call that freedom. The army should lead a force against these street gangs HA and rid the guns from our heads, .

  13.  Avatar

    No Lebanese want war only HA . No political party want war with Isreal but when HA Syria and Iran have guns on the heads of these people what chose do they have. Remember the days of car bombs when someone said a word or spoke out about HA Syria OR Iran. BANG call that freedom. The army should lead a force against these street gangs HA and rid the guns from our heads, .

  14. If you have children, there are several privately run, English speaking schools that teach the UK curriculum. You will have to pay between 5,000 and 10,000 euros per annum for your child to attend these schools. In comparison to private school fees in the UK this is very cheap.

  15. Javea is a complete mix of European and Spanish cultures. If you are looking for an expat community, where you can fit in and feel right at home, Javea can work for you. The Arenal area is where most of the British community frequent. But, if you’re looking for a life of integration with the Spanish community, the old town and the port can offer you this. Or a few miles inland towns and villages such as Benitachell, Jesus Pobre, Teulade, Gata, Pedreguer, can offer the Spanish life with only a short drive to all the comforts of home products.

    1. 5thDrawer Avatar

      Getting really tired of the ads …. but does it have a ‘clothing optional’ beach ??

  16. Javea is a complete mix of European and Spanish cultures. If you are looking for an expat community, where you can fit in and feel right at home, Javea can work for you. The Arenal area is where most of the British community frequent. But, if you’re looking for a life of integration with the Spanish community, the old town and the port can offer you this. Or a few miles inland towns and villages such as Benitachell, Jesus Pobre, Teulade, Gata, Pedreguer, can offer the Spanish life with only a short drive to all the comforts of home products.

    1.  Avatar

      Getting really tired of the ads …. but does it have a ‘clothing optional’ beach ??

  17. Javea is a lovely, seaside town which was once just a fishing village. Nowadays it still has a working fishing port but it is also an attractive holiday resort. You can book a luxury holiday villa for rent in Spain here, many of which can be rented from the private owners. If you want self-catering holiday accommodation in Spain in a picturesque town with a sandy beach and good tourist amenities this could be your perfect destination. The old part of the town is unspoilt and some of the shopkeepers speak the local language of ‘Valenciano’

  18. Javea is a lovely, seaside town which was once just a fishing village. Nowadays it still has a working fishing port but it is also an attractive holiday resort. You can book a luxury holiday villa for rent in Spain here, many of which can be rented from the private owners. If you want self-catering holiday accommodation in Spain in a picturesque town with a sandy beach and good tourist amenities this could be your perfect destination. The old part of the town is unspoilt and some of the shopkeepers speak the local language of ‘Valenciano’

  19. Benissa is not on the coast but it does have access to an area of the coast which has beautiful, white sand beaches. Benissa is always a popular place to book a holiday villa to rent in Spain with holidaymakers who enjoy water sports. The weather conditions in Benissa are ideal for scuba diving, snorkeling, windsurfing, water-skiing, sailing and fishing.

  20. Benissa is not on the coast but it does have access to an area of the coast which has beautiful, white sand beaches. Benissa is always a popular place to book a holiday villa to rent in Spain with holidaymakers who enjoy water sports. The weather conditions in Benissa are ideal for scuba diving, snorkeling, windsurfing, water-skiing, sailing and fishing.

  21. Serious overseas investors should consider Spain as an option to increase their portfolios. And one of the most popular locations for investment opportunities is a town on the Costa Blanca called Javea. With stunning scenery and attractions, Javea is a great investment for those looking to buy villas overseas.

  22. Serious overseas investors should consider Spain as an option to increase their portfolios. And one of the most popular locations for investment opportunities is a town on the Costa Blanca called Javea. With stunning scenery and attractions, Javea is a great investment for those looking to buy villas overseas.

  23.  Avatar

    Serious overseas investors should consider Spain as an option to increase their portfolios. And one of the most popular locations for investment opportunities is a town on the Costa Blanca called Javea. With stunning scenery and attractions, Javea is a great investment for those looking to buy villas overseas.

  24. For many of us with young families one of our prime concerns would be whether the property has a pool? Most Javea villas have their own private pool or communal pool, with lots of services available for pool maintenance by local property maintenance services keeping a property with swimming facilities need not be a drama either.

  25. . Rooms are quite large and each room offers a full

    view of the landscape and beautiful mountain and beach. The kitchen and the dining room are spacious

    and the entire villa is generously furnished. The rent is quite reasonable when compared to the luxury

    the villa offers; it is just £799 per week.

    1. yalibnan has not explained how villa  holliday spam goes unoticed and stays posted for weeks, yet prophet is baned from comenting on this site  falsely  acused of spam, his only guilt is respectfully asking yalibnan why his comments are not being posted.
      i am disturbed and disgusted,,,prophet we miss you where ever and  who ever you are…. you are one of us brother.

      yalibnan if you are for free speech and open to all points of view do something, we are all watching and waiting.

      1. 5thDrawer Avatar

        Yes .. hear, hear … indeed we are. But I still think it’s the robots ….
        Unless, of course, it’s for the great information he put at the bottom of this. But they have not removed it .. so …

      2. Yes sir, I miss you too Prophet. Why would he be band from commenting. I always enjoyed your comments. I think Yalibnan is run by commies.

    2. I’m looking for Strange, do you offer it? 

    3. 5thDrawer Avatar

      I hope that’s Lebanese pounds and not British …

  26. . Rooms are quite large and each room offers a full

    view of the landscape and beautiful mountain and beach. The kitchen and the dining room are spacious

    and the entire villa is generously furnished. The rent is quite reasonable when compared to the luxury

    the villa offers; it is just £799 per week.

    1. yalibnan has not explained how villa  holliday spam goes unoticed and stays posted for weeks, yet prophet is baned from comenting on this site  falsely  acused of spam, his only guilt is respectfully asking yalibnan why his comments are not being posted.
      i am disturbed and disgusted,,,prophet we miss you where ever and  who ever you are…. you are one of us brother.

      yalibnan if you are for free speech and open to all points of view do something, we are all watching and waiting.

      1.  Avatar

        Yes .. hear, hear … indeed we are. But I still think it’s the robots ….

      2.  Avatar

        Yes .. hear, hear … indeed we are. But I still think it’s the robots ….

      3.  Avatar

        Yes sir, I miss you too Prophet. Why would he be band from commenting. I always enjoyed your comments. I think Yalibnan is run by commies.

    2.  Avatar

      I’m looking for Strange, do you offer it? 

    3.  Avatar

      I hope that’s Lebanese pounds and not British …

  27. This beautiful and picturesque town in the midst of which are the traditionally built houses where many people from Scandinavia, Germany, Holland and Britain live, is the apt place for holidaying. There are many villas which host you at the most reasonable rate.

  28. This beautiful and picturesque town in the midst of which are the traditionally built houses where many people from Scandinavia, Germany, Holland and Britain live, is the apt place for holidaying. There are many villas which host you at the most reasonable rate.

  29.  
    Eating out has always been one of the big attractions in Spain. True, prices have risen since the arrival of the Euro, but you really don’t have to look hard to find great value, with many of the better restaurants now offering inventive and high quality “menu del dias” with dishes selected off the a la carte menu to attract in the clientele. And I don’t need to add the wine remains as tasty and cheap as ever!
    Yet Spain has become more than just an occasional holiday destination. Changes in the buying process over the years, the higher priority given to leisure time and most notably the increasing interest in second homes have all contributed to the house-buying boom over recent years.

  30.  
    Eating out has always been one of the big attractions in Spain. True, prices have risen since the arrival of the Euro, but you really don’t have to look hard to find great value, with many of the better restaurants now offering inventive and high quality “menu del dias” with dishes selected off the a la carte menu to attract in the clientele. And I don’t need to add the wine remains as tasty and cheap as ever!
    Yet Spain has become more than just an occasional holiday destination. Changes in the buying process over the years, the higher priority given to leisure time and most notably the increasing interest in second homes have all contributed to the house-buying boom over recent years.

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