Could Syria hand in chemical weapons and avoid strikes?

syria chemical attackRussia has proposed a surprise plan to break the deadlock over Syria’s chemical weapons.

Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov has offered to work with Syria to help turn the country’s chemical weapons stockpile over to the international community if it would avoid US military strikes.

Mr Lavrov’s comments came after US Secretary of State John Kerry was asked if Syria could avoid military action and replied that the country could hand over the stockpile of chemical weapons within the next week.

US officials later said Mr Kerry was making a “rhetorical argument” rather than a serious offer.

US president Barack Obama told CNNon Monday that he talked about this idea with his Russian counterpart, Vladimir Putin, when he was attending a Group of 20 summit last week in St. Petersburg, Russia.

BBC

  • Reasonableman

    Is it just me who realises putins a liar? His stance went from NOT guilty to GUILTY by even bringing up such a proposition. He originally defended bashar and blamed the chemical weapon attack in ghouta on the mujahadine. Now he turned over forgot his defence asking syria to hand over its chemical weapons… if he was so sure that the mujahadine are the culprits behind the chemical massacre why doesn’t he tell the mujahadine to hand in their chemical weapons to the international community?? BECAUSE THEY HAVE NONE!!! And or he is also in bed with america just stirring things up in the middle east instead of calling on international intervention what a sick joke.
    Whoever supports assad and his campaign please say ameen to this dua.
    Inshallah you end up in the same place as him in the hereafter.
    If you have no doubts say ameen.

    • dateam

      Why does religion have to come into everything? This is politics plain and simple. You and I and all of us people we dont mean anything to them. Are you telling me the Americans cant tell the Saudis to stop the rebels and sit down and talk? Likewise the Russians cant tell Assad to stop and sit down and talk? This is now a game of nations and in the meantime the military companies and establishment are churning in the dollars. Unfortunately you cant look at things emotionally because in the world arena of politics its “interests” that come first. This will go on and on I gave it 5 years we are now almost 3 years in. Over 100000 people have died and both sides have killed. Why should this issue be any different to any other? We still dont know enough about what happened. One source says over 1300 killed and another says 355? IThe UN says its mandate is to just verify if chemical weapons were used? You listen to what the Americans have said about this they never talked about regime change just punishing the government for supposed use of weapons. The drum beats of war began before the UN even finished then the british,french and americans have all pulled back. Now something has been worked out to save face for everyone involved and things will carry on as normal. people come last my friend just look at history.

      • Reasonableman

        Hey dateam i have definately proved my point. Staunch supporters of assad cant even say ameen to end up in the same place as him in the hereafter NOT even YOU.
        Why i made such a statement? To prove a point. Alot of so called “god fearing” people on this blog don’t care about the law its just a game “until you get caught.” Allah sees and hears everything it is not a game when his name is mentioned as there is no escape. Reasonably after approximately 100000 dead(yalibnans version of events) and no law in the land setup for(Assads) version of justice allah is the only person who will give it and always was from the start.
        You are an intellectual clearly you can identify fact an emotion and if you think religion is based on emotion thats your opinion but ill ask you then why follow it?
        Now you think my statement was piss poor and pouring with emotion how about all your hearsay all your numbers and information which lack weight (references) i had to laugh at 355 presumption and opinion?
        Yes- i agree unfortunately people do come last in the eyes of the superpowers, me i am willing to die for the truth. Some “parties” are wrong on both sides and i am more than happy to point out there faults and more than happy for them to point out mine. Thats what keeps me going if i was to live for anything besides knowing the truth and justice or anyone in that case will definately have a hard time in life can’t imagine how hard it is to live a lie… (well the syrians lived in lies and theyve had enough). So can you say ameen.?

        • dateam

          Huffington post….”We can’t get our heads around this – why would any commander agree to rocketing a suburb of Damascus with chemical weapons for only a very short-term tactical gain for what is a long-term disaster,” said Charles Heyman, a former British military officer who edits The Armed Forces of the U.K., an authoritative bi-annual review of British forces.

          Inconsistencies over the death toll and other details related to the attack also have fueled doubts among skeptics.

          The Obama administration says 1,429 people died in 12 locations mostly east of the capital, an estimate close to the one put out by the Western-backed Syrian National Coalition. When asked for victims’ names, however, the group provided a list of 395. On that list, some of the victims were identified by a first name only or said to be members of a certain family. There was no explanation for the hundreds of missing names.

          In Ghouta, Majed Abu Ali, a spokesman for 17 clinics and field hospitals near Damascus, produced the same list, saying the hospitals were unable to identify all the dead.

          Casualty estimates by other groups are far lower: The Britain-based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights says it only counts victims identified by name, and that its current total stands at 502. It has questioned the U.S. number and urged the Obama administration to release the information its figure is based on. The AP also has repeatedly asked for clarification on those numbers.

          The humanitarian group Doctors Without Borders says it has not been able to update its initial Aug. 24 estimate of 355 killed because communication with those on the ground around Damascus is difficult. That estimate was based on reports from three hospitals in the area supported by the group.

          BBC…Three days after the attack, medical charity Medecins Sans Frontieres confirmed that three hospitals it supports in Damascus treated about 3,600 patients with “neurotoxic symptoms” on the day of the attack. They said 355 of these died.

          Why do you always assume its an attack on you simply because someone does not agree with you or you do not agree with them?

          You are contradicting yourself in your comments when you mock my figures and then agree with me on people coming last.Then you claim you are happy to point out faults even your own but get defensive when one does that.

          In my comments to you I never disagreed or agreed with what you said I simply made a statement.

          Now in terms of saying ameen who are you for me to prove anything to you?
          I dont have to say ameen to you no more than I should have to pray behind someone that i feel is not worthy of it.

          This is a blog where people are free to say as they please with respect of course.
          Maybe im an atheist, or a communist or maybe i simply dont judge people by their religion or dont believe that religion and politics mix?

          In my opinion if you are looking at the issue in syria from a religious point of view then i ask the following:
          Why have more sunnis killed sunnis in the middle east than anywhere else?
          Where is the umma in regards to the palestinians who have been occupied for 70 years?
          Where is your bleeding heart for the 2000 muslims killed in myanmar 3 weeks ago?
          Where is the umma to stand up for the 70000 palestinian beddouin who have now been displaced from the negev desert so israel can build settlements?
          Last week israeli soldiers went into a palestinian camp in the west bank and killed 3 residents point blank.

          I could go on and on?

          What about the repression in the entire middle east from countries like saudia arabia, jordan…are they any different than assad?

          What about bahrain they have been revolting peacefully for 2 years as well yet the saudi army came in to help the bahrain monarchy did they not? Or sorry i forgot they dont count do they because you dont consider them to be muslim.

          And lets look at the countries that were successful in their revolts?
          Egypt- a mess the mb had their chance and they blew it.
          Libya – a mess no sectarianism their is there so why cant they work it out?
          Tunisia- Islamists attacking the army.

          The khalij has more weapons combined than anyone in the region. Why dont they send their armies in to do it?

          Again I could go on and on but by now you will accuse me of being a satan?

          You fail to understand that re syria alot of people initially were with it but as time has gone by the real revolutionaries of syria have been swallowed up by the islamist fanatics that have now overrun the legitimate opposition and gone beyond wanting assad gone to wanting a caliphate.

          When people like bandar have taken over the role of arming supplying the so called rebels and has the audacity to meet with putin and openly tell him he will keep russias interests in syria after “syria is under our control” or he will make sure the chechen rebels hes using wont attack the olympics in russia next year how do you expect any sane person to react to that?

          I will give you an example of the ignorance and discord as well as lack of coordination between the snc and takfiris in syria.
          After this so called chemical attack by assad and the entire world ready to pounce and with the worlds sympathy with the opposition…what do the so called rebels do? They go and attack a peaceful little village called maaloula in syria that has nothing to do with this…A village steeped in history dating back hundreds of years…on the unesco list of heritage and the only place on earth where aramaic is spoken. They bombed the churches and the arches to the entrance of the town>>>the village is virtually empty of its residents now. Gmayell went as far as contacting the UN to try and get them to stop attacking.

          General idris accuses russia and attacks putin i ask this of general idris…before he decided to defect was he not a general in the army? So in effect was he not part of the killing machine before this started? I wonder how many people hes killed in his time? Or how many shabiha he used to control?

          In regards to your comment about putin backtracking it was john kerry that made a slip of the tongue in one of his speeches that in order for assad to avoid a strike then he has to give up his chemical weapons. Putin simply pounced on that comment and said ok hel hand them in stop the strike.

          Its not about religion its about oil, money and power. 2 competing sides for a pipeline through syria and out to europe. If assad turned around tommorrow and said hel cut his ties with iran,russia and hzb the west will tell him do whatever you want.

          At least you agreed with me that people do come last.

          • 5thDrawer

            Very good ….
            I go along with the scientists and the ‘Doctors without borders’ who only state what they can prove and have verified. They are the humanitarians. Their only political goal is to stop suffering.
            But if someone needs to be dead to be a ‘victim’, then there should be better number-counting and a way of expressing other damages which means something.
            And names?? If a whole family is gone, or a whole neighbourhood, who is left to make identification ? Pictorial body-counts would work … if you could get them all in one photo ….

          • Reasonableman

            Dateam relax bro i am confident its not an attack on me i know if anything the prophet peace be upon him taught us that its not hate between people its the hate of the idea that enrages people. Cut a long story short this is called objective criticism and if you were to challenge my statement i expect you to stay within the rules of objection rather than let your jugular vein burst.
            Who am i? I am just like you somebody looking for truth in this jungle, i read your comment but couldnt swallow due to your undecisivness to commit to the side which you constantly propose are legitament. This is counter productive and only gives room for lies and phsyc games.
            You still are giving only opinion on this village of maloula several sources say including a video and a statement by joulani(leader of jabhat al nusra) to protect the christians and all costs. You also have preists saying how good the FSA have been and that its not fair the media portraying them as destructive.
            Ofcourse than you have other sources which say are destructive and i wont deny there are some sick individuals between them committing kufr INCLUDING mercaneries from assads regime.
            Like 5th said with the numbers and the numbers were not what my post was aimed at i was just trying to show you your faults like you have showed me mine the point is that chemical weapons were used nothing more nothing less and now assad has admitted he stores chemical weapons and sufficient evidence shows he has used them. I mean thats a combo to admit you have chemical weapons after denying proves he is a LIAR! The fsa may or may not have chemical weapons may or may not have used them but there is certainly no concrete proving they have store them therefore you may be jeopradising their abilities by jumping to conclusions and SPREADING for no particular reason their actions and inactions.
            Im not even going to get into religion and if you can pray behind me or i pray behind you thats for you to take into account and seek truth for. But i definately know your not an athiest 😉
            You know right from wrong but it seems you have alot of distortion with this religious baggage your holding from reading news in other parts of the middle east. This is irrelivant to my statement or to the post but PROVES your judgement in this part of the middle east and my statement has been affected. Maybe the circus is all in your head. Too much theory and not enough practise(reading too much news and not doing much to solve it) does eventually catch up.
            I appreciate your feedback anyway.
            Yes i do agree that it is hungry world powers who are fueling this but then to jump from all the people who have been killed to the world powers is abit extreme and i dont mean to sound like a prick honestly but if we take it a step at a time justice to the killers and those who have been killed and the real problem that the syrians want to be heard and not dictated the truth will speak for itself and eventually the world powers will have there turn to be judged.

  • Reasonableman

    Is it just me who realises putins a liar? His stance went from NOT guilty to GUILTY by even bringing up such a proposition. He originally defended bashar and blamed the chemical weapon attack in ghouta on the mujahadine. Now he turned over forgot his defence asking syria to hand over its chemical weapons… if he was so sure that the mujahadine are the culprits behind the chemical massacre why doesn’t he tell the mujahadine to hand in their chemical weapons to the international community?? BECAUSE THEY HAVE NONE!!! And or he is also in bed with america just stirring things up in the middle east.
    Whoever supports assad and his campaign please say ameen to this dua.
    Inshallah you end up in the same place as him in the hereafter.
    If you have no doubts say ameen.

    • dateam

      Why does religion have to come into everything? This is politics plain and simple. You and I and all of us people we dont mean anything to them. Are you telling me the Americans cant tell the Saudis to stop the rebels and sit down and talk? Likewise the Russians cant tell Assad to stop and sit down and talk? This is now a game of nations and in the meantime the military companies and establishment are churning in the dollars. Unfortunately you cant look at things emotionally because in the world arena of politics its “interests” that come first. This will go on and on I gave it 5 years we are now almost 3 years in. Over 100000 people have died and both sides have killed. Why should this issue be any different to any other? We still dont know enough about what happened. One source says over 1300 killed and another says 355? IThe UN says its mandate is to just verify if chemical weapons were used? You listen to what the Americans have said about this they never talked about regime change just punishing the government for supposed use of weapons. The drum beats of war began before the UN even finished then the british,french and americans have all pulled back. Now something has been worked out to save face for everyone involved and things will carry on as normal. people come last my friend just look at history.

      • Reasonableman

        Hey dateam i have definately proved my point. Staunch supporters of assad cant even say ameen to end up in the same place as him in the hereafter NOT even YOU.
        Why i made such a statement? To prove a point. Alot of so called “god fearing” people on this blog don’t care about the law its just a game “until you get caught.” Allah sees and hears everything it is not a game when his name is mentioned as there is no escape. Reasonably after approximately 100000 dead(yalibnans version of events) and no law in the land setup for(Assads) version of justice allah is the only person who will give it and always was from the start.
        You are an intellectual clearly you can identify fact an emotion and if you think religion is based on emotion thats your opinion but ill ask you then why follow it?
        Now you think my statement was piss poor and pouring with emotion how about all your hearsay all your numbers and information which lack weight (references) i had to laugh at 355.
        Yes unfortunately people do come last in the eyes of the superpowers, me i am willing to die for the truth. Some “parties” are wrong on both sides and i am more than happy to point out there faults and more than happy for them to point out mine. Thats what keeps me going if i was to live for anything besides knowing the truth and justice or anyone in that case will definately have a hard time in life. So can you say ameen.?

        • dateam

          Huffington post….”We can’t get our heads around this – why would any commander agree to rocketing a suburb of Damascus with chemical weapons for only a very short-term tactical gain for what is a long-term disaster,” said Charles Heyman, a former British military officer who edits The Armed Forces of the U.K., an authoritative bi-annual review of British forces.

          Inconsistencies over the death toll and other details related to the attack also have fueled doubts among skeptics.

          The Obama administration says 1,429 people died in 12 locations mostly east of the capital, an estimate close to the one put out by the Western-backed Syrian National Coalition. When asked for victims’ names, however, the group provided a list of 395. On that list, some of the victims were identified by a first name only or said to be members of a certain family. There was no explanation for the hundreds of missing names.

          In Ghouta, Majed Abu Ali, a spokesman for 17 clinics and field hospitals near Damascus, produced the same list, saying the hospitals were unable to identify all the dead.

          Casualty estimates by other groups are far lower: The Britain-based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights says it only counts victims identified by name, and that its current total stands at 502. It has questioned the U.S. number and urged the Obama administration to release the information its figure is based on. The AP also has repeatedly asked for clarification on those numbers.

          The humanitarian group Doctors Without Borders says it has not been able to update its initial Aug. 24 estimate of 355 killed because communication with those on the ground around Damascus is difficult. That estimate was based on reports from three hospitals in the area supported by the group.

          BBC…Three days after the attack, medical charity Medecins Sans Frontieres confirmed that three hospitals it supports in Damascus treated about 3,600 patients with “neurotoxic symptoms” on the day of the attack. They said 355 of these died.

          Why do you always assume its an attack on you simply because someone does not agree with you or you do not agree with them?

          You are contradicting yourself in your comments when you mock my figures and then agree with me on people coming last.Then you claim you are happy to point out faults even your own but get defensive when one does that.

          In my comments to you I never disagreed or agreed with what you said I simply made a statement.

          Now in terms of saying ameen who are you for me to prove anything to you?
          I dont have to say ameen to you no more than I should have to pray behind someone that i feel is not worthy of it.

          This is a blog where people are free to say as they please with respect of course.
          Maybe im an atheist, or a communist or maybe i simply dont judge people by their religion or dont believe that religion and politics mix?

          In my opinion if you are looking at the issue in syria from a religious point of view then i ask the following:
          Why have more sunnis killed sunnis in the middle east than anywhere else?
          Where is the umma in regards to the palestinians who have been occupied for 70 years?
          Where is your bleeding heart for the 2000 muslims killed in myanmar 3 weeks ago?
          Where is the umma to stand up for the 70000 palestinian beddouin who have now been displaced from the negev desert so israel can build settlements?
          Last week israeli soldiers went into a palestinian camp in the west bank and killed 3 residents point blank.

          I could go on and on?

          What about the repression in the entire middle east from countries like saudia arabia, jordan…are they any different than assad?

          What about bahrain they have been revolting peacefully for 2 years as well yet the saudi army came in to help the bahrain monarchy did they not? Or sorry i forgot they dont count do they because you dont consider them to be muslim.

          And lets look at the countries that were successful in their revolts?
          Egypt- a mess the mb had their chance and they blew it.
          Libya – a mess no sectarianism their is there so why cant they work it out?
          Tunisia- Islamists attacking the army.

          The khalij has more weapons combined than anyone in the region. Why dont they send their armies in to do it?

          Again I could go on and on but by now you will accuse me of being a satan?

          You fail to understand that re syria alot of people initially were with it but as time has gone by the real revolutionaries of syria have been swallowed up by the islamist fanatics that have now overrun the legitimate opposition and gone beyond wanting assad gone to wanting a caliphate.

          When people like bandar have taken over the role of arming supplying the so called rebels and has the audacity to meet with putin and openly tell him he will keep russias interests in syria after “syria is under our control” or he will make sure the chechen rebels hes using wont attack the olympics in russia next year how do you expect any sane person to react to that?

          I will give you an example of the ignorance and discord as well as lack of coordination between the snc and takfiris in syria.
          After this so called chemical attack by assad and the entire world ready to pounce and with the worlds sympathy with the opposition…what do the so called rebels do? They go and attack a peaceful little village called maaloula in syria that has nothing to do with this…A village steeped in history dating back hundreds of years…on the unesco list of heritage and the only place on earth where aramaic is spoken. They bombed the churches and the arches to the entrance of the town>>>the village is virtually empty of its residents now. Gmayell went as far as contacting the UN to try and get them to stop attacking.

          General idris accuses russia and attacks putin i ask this of general idris…before he decided to defect was he not a general in the army? So in effect was he not part of the killing machine before this started? I wonder how many people hes killed in his time? Or how many shabiha he used to control?

          In regards to your comment about putin backtracking it was john kerry that made a slip of the tongue in one of his speeches that in order for assad to avoid a strike then he has to give up his chemical weapons. Putin simply pounced on that comment and said ok hel hand them in stop the strike.

          Its not about religion its about oil, money and power. 2 competing sides for a pipeline through syria and out to europe. If assad turned around tommorrow and said hel cut his ties with iran,russia and hzb the west will tell him do whatever you want.

          At least you agreed with me that people do come last.

          • 5thDrawer

            Very good ….
            I go along with the scientists and the ‘Doctors without borders’ who only state what they can prove and have verified. They are the humanitarians. Their only political goal is to stop suffering.
            But if someone needs to be dead to be a ‘victim’, then there should be better number-counting and a way of expressing other damages which means something.
            And names?? If a whole family is gone, or a whole neighbourhood, who is left to make identification ? Pictorial body-counts would work … if you could get them all in one photo ….

          • Reasonableman

            Dateam relax bro i am confident its not an attack on me i know if anything the prophet peace be upon him taught us that its not hate between people its the hate of the idea that enrages people. Cut a long story short this is called objective criticism and if you were to challenge my statement i expect you to stay within the rules of objection rather than let your jugular vein burst.
            Who am i? I am just like you somebody looking for truth in this jungle, i read your comment but couldnt swallow due to your undecisivness to commit to the side which you constantly propose are legitament. This is counter productive and only gives room for lies and phsyc games.
            You still are giving only opinion on this village of maloula several sources say including a video and a statement by joulani(leader of jabhat al nusra) to protect the christians and all costs. You also have preists saying how good the FSA have been and that its not fair the media portraying them as destructive.
            Ofcourse than you have other sources which say are destructive and i wont deny there are some sick individuals between them committing kufr INCLUDING mercaneries from assads regime.
            Like 5th said with the numbers and the numbers were not what my post was aimed at i was just trying to show you your faults like you have showed me mine the point is that chemical weapons were used nothing more nothing less and now assad has admitted he stores chemical weapons and sufficient evidence shows he has used them. I mean thats a combo to admit you have chemical weapons after denying proves he is a LIAR! The fsa may or may not have chemical weapons may or may not have used them but there is certainly no concrete proving they have store them therefore you may be jeopradising their abilities by jumping to conclusions and SPREADING for no particular reason that they are behind the chemical attack and backing a regime you are UNDECISIVE about.
            Im not even going to get into religion and if you can pray behind me or i pray behind you thats for you to take into account and seek truth for. But i definately know your not an athiest 😉
            You know right from wrong but it seems you have alot of unclarity with this religious weight your holding in other parts of the middle east. This is unneccessary to my statement or to the post but PROVES your judgement in this part of the middle east has been affected. Maybe the circus is all in your head. Too much theory and not enough practise does eventually catch up.
            I appreciate your feedback anyway.

  • Hannibal

    To the Indian poster who tucked his tail and ran:

    Hey lunatic,
    With 5000 nuclear heads in the U.S. without counting allies’ nukes you really think India can prevail? Go back to that shit hole you live in or bathe in that diarrhea filled river of yours.
    Do not forget to shave your filthy beard in that sewer country of yours.

    • dateam

      whose this comment referring to?

      • Hannibal

        A stupid Indian guy advocating to nuke people.

  • Hannibal

    To the Indian poster who tucked his tail and ran:

    Hey lunatic,
    With 5000 nuclear heads in the U.S. without counting allies’ nukes you really think India can prevail? Go back to that shit hole you live in or bathe in that diarrhea filled river of yours.
    Do not forget to shave your filthy beard in that sewer country of yours.

    • dateam

      whose this comment referring to?

      • Hannibal

        A stupid Indian guy advocating to nuke people.

  • wargame1

    Assad wont give his chemical weapons but he has the opportunity to play with the situation now. The rebels are concentrating on attacking Assad and thats is the ultimate threat to Assad. The rebel attack is not going to stop.

  • wargame1

    Assad wont give his chemical weapons but he has the opportunity to play with the situation now. The rebels are concentrating on attacking Assad and thats is the ultimate threat to Assad. The rebel attack is not going to stop.

  • 5thDrawer

    So … What’s happening ??
    Lots, in a week …. it seems.
    Flip, flop, flip, flop ….. Jumblatitis ??

    • dateam

      You have missed alot of action…tuck your skirt in and watch the circus roll on.

      • 5thDrawer

        Errr … thanks Dateam. :-)) I’ll try to play ‘catch-up’.
        But it seems the same circus is in town …. only the Calliope is louder …

  • 5thDrawer

    So … What’s happening ??

    • dateam

      You have missed alot of action…tuck your skirt in and watch the circus roll on.

      • 5thDrawer

        Errr … thanks Dateam. :-))